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00:00:01ANNOUNCER: SUPPORT FOR THE
STATEWIDE BROADCAST OF "THE
00:00:03STATE OF OHIO" COMES FROM THE
LAW FIRM OF PORTER, WRIGHT,
00:00:08MORRIS AND ARTHUR, LLP., HELPING
BUSINESS AND INDIVIDUAL WITH
00:00:10COMPLEX LEGAL PROBLEMS IN OHIO,
ACROSS THE COUNTRY, AND AROUND
00:00:12THE WORLD.
ON THE WEB AT PORTERWRIGHT.COM.
00:00:16AND FROM THE OHIO EDUCATION
ASSOCIATION, REPRESENTING
00:00:20120,000 MEMBERS WHO WORK TO
INSPIRE THEIR STUDENTS TO THINK
00:00:23CREATIVELY AND EXPERIENCE THE
JOY OF LEARNING.
00:00:25ONLINE AT OHEA.COM.
KAREN: TWO DEVELOPMENTS IN THE
00:00:32BATTLE BETWEEN THE STATE AND
PLANNED PARENTHOOD.
00:00:34AND SCHOOL MAY BE OUT FOR THE
SUMMER, BUT CHARTER SCHOOLS ARE
00:00:36STILL A HOT TOPIC.
I'LL TALK TO TWO RESEARCHERS ON
00:00:38BOTH SIDES OF THE CHARTER SCHOOL
DEBATE ABOUT THE MONEY THAT'S
00:00:41GOING TO THAT INDUSTRY.
ALL THIS WEEK IN "THE STATE OF
00:00:44OHIO."
[CAPTIONING PERFORMED BY THE
00:00:47NATIONAL CAPTIONING INSTITUTE,
WHICH IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ITS
00:00:49CAPTION CONTENT AND ACCURACY.
VISIT NCICAP.ORG]
00:00:50KAREN: THE ORDER STOPPING A LAW
00:00:56THAT STRIPS MORE THAN $1 MILLION
IN FUNDING FOR PLANNED
00:00:59PARENTHOOD HAS BEEN EXTENDED
UNTIL AUGUST 5.
00:01:05U.S. DISTRICT JUDGE MICHAEL
BARRETT HAS SET A HEARING FOR
00:01:10AUGUST 2.
HE HAD PUT THE LAW ON HOLD THE
00:01:12DAY IT WAS SUPPOSED TO TAKE
EFFECT, AFTER PLANNED PARENTHOOD
00:01:14SAID IT VIOLATED THE
ORGANIZATION'S CONSTITUTIONAL
00:01:16RIGHTS BY DENYING THE FUNDS "IN
RETALIATION FOR" PROVIDING
00:01:17ABORTIONS.
THE LAW PASSED MOSTLY ALONG
00:01:22PARTY LINES THIS WINTER TARGETS
MONEY THAT PLANNED PARENTHOOD
00:01:24GETS THROUGH OHIO'S HEALTH
DEPARTMENT.
00:01:25THE LAW BANNED MONEY FROM GOING
TO ENTITIES THAT PERFORM OR
00:01:28PROMOTE ABORTIONS.
THAT MONEY IS MOSTLY FEDERAL AND
00:01:32SUPPORTS INITIATIVES THAT
PROVIDE HIV TESTS, CANCER
00:01:36SCREENINGS AND OTHER PREVENTION
, SERVICES.
00:01:39MEANWHILE, THE STATE WILL PAY
MORE THAN $45,000 IN LEGAL BILLS
00:01:41FOR PLANNED PARENTHOOD AS PART
OF A DISPUTE INVOLVING THE
00:01:44DISPOSAL OF REMAINS OF
ABORTIONS.
00:01:46THE MOVE IS PART OF A SETTLEMENT
REACHED AFTER PLANNED PARENTHOOD
00:01:49SUED THE STATE LAST YEAR.
ATTORNEY GENERAL SPOKESMAN DAN
00:01:53TIERNEY SAYS THE DEAL REACHED
BACK IN DECEMBER ALSO SAID THE
00:01:55STATE WOULD NOT ENFORCE A HEALTH
DEPARTMENT RULE INVOLVING
00:01:58DISPOSAL OF FETAL REMAINS.
MR. TIERNEY: WHAT THIS REALLY
00:02:04WAS WAS AN AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE
DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH AND THE
00:02:06PLAINTIFFS FOR ATTORNEY FEES.
KAREN: BUT PLANNED PARENTHOOD'S
00:02:09ATTORNEY, AL GERHARDSTEIN, SAYS
THE RULE IS UNCONSTITUTIONALLY
00:02:11VAGUE AND SAYS HIS CLIENT WASN'T
VIOLATING IT.
00:02:15MR. GERHARDSTEIN: IN FACT, THE
STATE WAS USING THE SAME THING
00:02:18WITH RESPECT TO SOME OF THEIR
MEDICAL FACILITIES.
00:02:21KAREN: A FEDERAL JUDGE HAD
TEMPORARILY BLOCKED OHIO HEALTH
00:02:23OFFICIALS FROM TAKING LEGAL
ACTION AGAINST PLANNED
00:02:25PARENTHOOD, WHICH HAD ACCUSED
THE STATE OF CHANGING THE
00:02:27INTERPRETATION OF THE DISPOSAL
REGULATION AND THEN UNFAIRLY
00:02:30TARGETING THE ORGANIZATION.
THE STATE ULTIMATELY SAID IT
00:02:35WOULD NOT ENFORCE THE REGULATION
AS LAWMAKERS SEEK TO CLARIFY
00:02:38DISPOSAL PROCEDURES.
STATE LAWMAKERS ARE CONSIDERING
00:02:42TWO DIFFERENT BILLS TO REQUIRE
FETAL REMAINS BE DISPOSED OF
00:02:45WITH EITHER CREMATION OR BURIAL.
NEARLY A YEAR AFTER LEGISLATION
00:02:49WAS SIGNED, OHIO IS NOW THE
FIRST STATE TO OFFER
00:02:53TAX-ADVANTAGED SAVINGS AND
INVESTMENT ACCOUNTS FOR ELIGIBLE
00:02:56CHILDREN AND ADULTS WITH
DISABILITIES.
00:02:59THE STATE LEGISLATION THAT
CREATED THE ACCOUNTS WAS
00:03:02UNVEILED IN APRIL 2015 AND WAS
SIGNED LAST JULY.
00:03:04THE ACCOUNTS, WHICH ARE
ADMINISTERED BY THE STATE
00:03:06TREASURER'S OFFICE, ALLOW PEOPLE
TO ACCUMULATE MONEY FOR COLLEGE,
00:03:10RETIREMENT, OR OTHER PURPOSES
WITHOUT LOSING ELIGIBILITY FOR
00:03:13CERTAIN BENEFITS PROGRAMS, SUCH
AS MEDICAID, SSI AND OR SSDI.
00:03:21OHIO UNIVERSITY AND JOURNALISTS
AROUND THE COUNTRY ARE MOURNING
00:03:23THE LOSS OF GUIDO STEMPEL, III,
AN OU PROFESSOR WHO WAS
00:03:25INSTRUMENTAL IN SHAPING THE
CURRICULUM OF THE JOURNALISM
00:03:28SCHOOL AND THE CAREERS OF
HUNDREDS OF STUDENTS.
00:03:30STEMPEL WAS THE DIRECTOR OF THE
SCHOOL OF JOURNALISM AND ALSO
00:03:36LED THE GRADUATE PROGRAM AND THE
JOURNALISM HONORS PROGRAM.
00:03:38STEMPEL DIED OF CANCER THIS
WEEK.
00:03:39HE WAS 87.
JUST HOURS AFTER STATE LAWMAKERS
00:03:42APPROVED A HISTORIC AND TIGHTLY
CRAFTED MEDICAL MARIJUANA BILL,
00:03:45A GROUP THAT HAD CRITICIZED THE
BILL IN LIGHT OF ITS OWN
00:03:48CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT
ABANDONED ITS CAMPAIGN FOR THE
00:03:51FALL BALLOT.
AFTER LAWMAKERS PASSED THE
00:03:53MEDICAL MARIJUANA BILL LAST
WEEK, OHIOANS FOR MEDICAL
00:03:56MARIJUANA SAID IT FELL SHORT --
SPOKESMAN AARON MARSHALL WAS ON
00:04:01THIS SHOW LAST WEEK SAYING THE
MEASURE WAS INADEQUATE BECAUSE
00:04:03IT DIDN'T ALLOW FOR HOME GROWING
OR SMOKING AND LIMITED THE
00:04:07CONDITIONS FOR WHICH POT COULD
BE RECOMMENDED BY DOCTORS.
00:04:10BUT ON SATURDAY, MARSHALL SAID
THE GROUP HAD TO FACE THE
00:04:13REALITY OF RUNNING ITS CAMPAIGN
IN THE WAKE OF THE PASSAGE OF
00:04:18THE BILL DURING A YEAR IN WHICH
OHIO WILL BE A BATTLEGROUND IN
00:04:22BOTH OF THE PRESIDENTIAL RACE
AND THE U.S. SENATE CONTEST.
00:04:27MR. MARSHALL RAISING MONEY FOR
: MEDICAL MARIJUANA POLICY
00:04:30CHANGES IS INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT.
AND GIVEN THE IMPROVEMENTS THAT
00:04:32WERE MADE LATE IN THE GAME BY
THE LEGISLATURE AND THE FACT
00:04:36THAT THE GOVERNOR'S EXPECTED TO
SIGN IT, IT'S JUST A TOUGH ROAD
00:04:39FORWARD FOR US.
KAREN: HOUSE SPEAKER CLIFF
00:04:41ROSENBERGER SAID IN A STATEMENT
THAT READS IN PART --
00:04:42MARIJUANA POLICY PROJECT
CHOOSING TO WITHDRAW ITS BALLOT
00:04:45INITIATIVE IS WELCOMED NEWS.
BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, IT IS AN
00:04:48INDICATION OF THE GENERAL
ASSEMBLY'S WILLINGNESS TO LISTEN
00:04:50AND RESPOND TO THE WILL OF
OHIOANS.
00:04:54THEY MARIJUANA POLICY PROJECT IS
WORKING WITH OHIOANS FOR MEDICAL
00:05:01MARIJUANA TO PASS THAT
CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT.
00:05:03THE NUMBERS OF KIDS WHO ARE
REPORTED TO BE ATTENDING CHARTER
00:05:04SCHOOLS CAN BE DIFFERENT THAN
THE NUMBERS OF KIDS ACTUALLY
00:05:05GOING TO THOSE SCHOOLS.
STATE AUDITOR DAVE YOST PROVED
00:05:08THAT TWO YEARS AGO WITH POP-UP
VISITS ONE DAY IN 2014, WHEN HE
00:05:17ORDERED STAFFERS TO SHOW UP AT
CHARTER SCHOOLS FOR SURPRISE
00:05:19VISITS TO TAKE ATTENDANCE.
YOST SAID THEN THAT THOSE
00:05:21POP-INS NEARLY HALF THE SCHOOLS
HAD THE NUMBER OF STUDENTS THEY
00:05:23TOLD THE STATE THEY DID.
BUT THERE WERE DISCREPANCIES
00:05:25AMONG THE NUMBERS REPORTED BY
THE OTHER SCHOOLS AND THE
00:05:27NUMBERS OF STUDENTS THEY
ACTUALLY HAD IN CLASS.
00:05:30YOST SAID HE WANTED TO KEEP TABS
ON CHARTER SCHOOLS AND THEIR
00:05:37REPORTED ATTENDANCE.
HE CONDUCTED ANOTHER SURPRISE
00:05:38HEAD COUNT IN NOVEMBER AND
REPORTED RECENTLY THAT 30
00:05:42CHARTER SCHOOLS AUDITED HAD
ATTENDANCE RATES RANGING FROM
00:05:4529% TO 99%.
THEIR TRADITIONAL SCHOOL
00:05:48COUNTERPARTS WERE BETWEEN 75%
AND 99%.
00:05:52BUT OF THE 14 DROPOUT RECOVERY
AND PREVENTION SCHOOLS VISITED
00:05:56ON THE DAY HE PICKED TO LOG
STUDENT ATTENDANCE NONE OF THEM
00:06:01, HAD MORE THAN HALF THE AMOUNT
OF STUDENTS THAT WERE SUPPOSED
00:06:02TO BE THERE.
AND WHEN HE MADE THAT
00:06:04ANNOUNCEMENT, YOST DIDN'T HOLD
BACK WHEN TALKING ABOUT THE
00:06:06AGENCY THAT OVERSEES CHARTER
SCHOOLS, THE OHIO DEPARTMENT OF
00:06:09EDUCATION.
MR. YOST: I'M IN A POSITION
00:06:14HAVING BEEN IN ALL THE
DEPARTMENTS TO BE ABLE TO TELL
00:06:17YOU, FRANKLY THAT ODE IS AMONG
, THE WORST, IF NOT THE WORST
00:06:23RUN STATE AGENCY IN STATE
, GOVERNMENT.
00:06:25KAREN: YOST SAYS IT WOULD HELP
TO REDISTRIBUTE THE DUTIES OF
00:06:28THE AGENCY, BUT SAYS IT'S UP TO
THE LEGISLATURE TO DO THAT.
00:06:31LAST WEEK, I SAT DOWN WITH TWO
LEADING SENATORS WHO ARE VERY
00:06:33INVOLVED WITH EDUCATION ISSUES
AND CHARTER SCHOOLS IN
00:06:35PARTICULAR -- EDUCATION
COMMITTEE CHAIR PEGGY LEHNER, A
00:06:37REPUBLICAN OF KETTERING AND
MINORITY LEADER JOE SCHIAVONI, A
00:06:39DEMOCRAT OF BOARDMAN.
I ASKED THEM BOTH WHAT THEY
00:06:40THOUGHT OF YOST'S COMMENTS.
MR. SCHIAVONI: STRONG LANGUAGE,
00:06:50RIGHT?
I SAW THAT.
00:06:50THERE ARE MAJOR PROBLEMS IN ODE.
HAVING THIS LEADERSHIP CHANGE AT
00:06:55THE TOP IS A GOOD THING, AND WE
WILL SEE HOW IT GOES NEXT YEAR.
00:06:57MS. LEHNER: IT IS HARD TO
ANALYZE AND AGENCY LIKE THAT.
00:07:03YOU SEE THE BAD AND NOT THE
THINGS WORKING WELL.
00:07:04THE WHOLE EDUCATION ENVIRONMENT
IS A VERY DIFFICULT ONE TO WORK
00:07:09IN.
THERE ARE SO MANY DIFFERENT
00:07:11BOSSES.
AND WHEN YOU ARE THE
00:07:17SUPERINTENDENT OF A SINGLE
DISTRICT, EVERYONE WORKS FOR
00:07:18YOU.
WHEN YOU ARE SUPERINTENDENT AT
00:07:20THE STATE DISTRICT, NOBODY WORKS
FOR YOU EXCEPT THE PEOPLE IN THE
00:07:24BUILDING.
YOU HAVE GOT THE HOUSE AND THE
00:07:28SENATE, EDUCATION COMMITTEE, THE
GOVERNOR, THE REGENTS, 614 LOCAL
00:07:34SCHOOL BOARDS, SUPERINTENDENTS,
AND YOU HAVE HUNDREDS OF
00:07:39THOUSANDS OF TEACHERS, AND YOU
HAVE ALL THESE PARENTS, AND THE
00:07:45EDUCATION OF THEIR CHILDREN IS
PRETTY IMPORTANT.
00:07:47SO IT IS A VERY CHALLENGING
AGENCY TO RUN.
00:07:49I AM JUST DELIGHTED WITH THE
SELECTION OF THE NEW
00:07:54SUPERINTENDENT.
I THINK DR. DEMARIA WILL BE JUST
00:07:59A FABULOUS CHOICE, AND I AM
REALLY LOOKING FORWARD TO
00:08:04WORKING WITH HIM.
I THINK THE PROBLEMS OVER THERE,
00:08:07WE WILL GET THEM FIRED UP.
KAREN: DO YOU THINK THAT MORE
00:08:10FUNDING IS NEEDED TO HIRE MORE
PEOPLE AND HAVE MORE RESOURCES?
00:08:14MS. LEHNER: I THINK THEY ARE LOW
IN STAFF, VERY LOW.
00:08:19THEY HAVE GOT A LOT OF VERY GOOD
PEOPLE OVER THE LAST SEVERAL
00:08:21YEARS.
KAREN: MEANWHILE, AS OHIO SCHOOL
00:08:27KIDS WERE PACKING UP FOR SUMMER
BREAK, A REPORT OUT LAST WEEK ON
00:08:30CHARTER SCHOOL FUNDING BY A
LIBERAL LEANING THINK TANK AND
00:08:33THE STATE'S LARGEST TEACHERS
UNION SHOWED THE FEDERAL
00:08:40GOVERNMENT HAS PUT NEARLY $30
MILLION INTO CHARTER SCHOOLS
00:08:41THAT HAVE EITHER CLOSED OR NEVER
OPENED IN THE FIRST PLACE.
00:08:43AND THE REPORT FROM INNOVATION
OHIO'S KNOW YOUR CHARTER PROJECT
00:08:46AND THE OHIO EDUCATION
ASSOCIATION, WHICH, IN FULL
00:08:53DISCLOSURE, IS AN UNDERWRITER OF
THIS PROGRAM, SHOWED MORE THAN
00:08:57ONE-THIRD OF THOSE CHARTERS OVER
THE LAST DECADE HAVE FAILED.
00:08:59BUT A CHARTER SCHOOL ADVOCACY
GROUP SAID THE REPORT IS
00:09:00MISLEADING AND ISN'T
COMPREHENSIVE, AND INTENTIONALLY
00:09:02INFLATES THE INDUSTRY'S
FAILURES.
00:09:06AND THIS IS NOT IMPORTANT JUST
BECAUSE OF THE $30 MILLION THAT
00:09:08WENT TO THE 108 SCHOOLS THAT
FAILED.
00:09:10IT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE OHIO
COULD BE IN LINE FOR $71 MILLION
00:09:12IN NEW FEDERAL GRANTS FOR
CHARTERS.
00:09:15HERE TO TALK ABOUT THE REPORT IS
ITS AUTHOR, STEPHEN DYER, A
00:09:19DEMOCRATIC FORMER STATE
REPRESENTATIVE FROM THE AKRON
00:09:21AREA.
HE IS WITH THE KNOW YOUR CHARTER
00:09:27PROJECT.
ALSO HERE TO DISCUSS IT IS CHAD
00:09:29ALDIS, THE VICE PRESIDENT OF THE
PRO-CHARTER GROUP THAT ISSUED
00:09:31THAT CRITICISM I JUST MENTIONED,
THE THOMAS B. FORDHAM INSTITUTE.
00:09:36WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.
I WANT TO START WITH YOU,
00:09:38STEPHEN DYER.
ADDRESS THE CONCERNS FROM THE
00:09:43FORDHAM INSTITUTE UP FRONT, THAT
THIS OFFERS INFLATED ESTIMATES
00:09:47OF FAILURE, GAVE MISLEADING
INFORMATION.
00:09:52MR. DYER: I WISH THAT WERE TRUE,
I REALLY DO.
00:09:57THE FACT IS THAT, OUT OF THE 292
CHARTER SCHOOLS THAT HAVE
00:10:03RECEIVED FEDERAL GRANT MONEY,
MEANT TO GROW HIGH-PERFORMING
00:10:05CHARTERS, AT LEAST 108 OF THEM
CLOSED DOWN OR NEVER OPENED.
00:10:10THAT IS A RATE OF ABOUT 37%.
IF YOU LOOK AT ALL FEDERAL
00:10:18PROGRAMS, ALL FEDERAL GRANTS,
AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT
00:10:24PROGRAMS GIVEN TO EVERY COMPANY
THAT HAS EVER GOTTEN THEM SINCE
00:10:252000, ONLY 15 HAVE SHUTTERED
THEIR DOORS.
00:10:30THAT IS WHAT REALLY STOOD OUT TO
ME, THE FACT THAT WE ARE, YOU
00:10:33KNOW, PUTTING LOTS OF MONEY INTO
CHARTERS THAT NEVER OPENED OR
00:10:36END UP CLOSING REALLY QUICKLY.
IS NO QUESTION THAT THE MONEY
00:10:40WENT TO SOME HIGH-PERFORMING
CHARTERS.
00:10:43WE SAID THAT IN THE NEWS
CONFERENCE AND THE REPORT, A LOT
00:10:47OF PLACES.
OUR CONCERN IS NOT REALLY ABOUT
00:10:49WHICH CHARTERS WERE CLOSING,
WHICH WERE SHUTTING, WHICH WERE
00:10:55SPONSORED BY WHICH, OUR CONCERN
WAS THAT THE STATE DEPARTMENT OF
00:10:59EDUCATION WAS GIVING A FEDERAL
GRANT MONEY MEANT TO GROW
00:11:02HIGH-PERFORMING CHARTERS, AND IN
A LOT OF CASES, IT WAS NOT EVEN
00:11:05THE CHARTERS THAT RECEIVED
LITTLE MONEY THAT ARE STILL
00:11:08OPEN, MANY ARE NOT SUCCEEDING.
AGAIN, IT IS NOT LIKE -- AND THE
00:11:17DATA ONLY GOES BACK 10 YEARS, SO
WE HAVE RECEIVED THE
00:11:20THIRD-HIGHEST AMOUNT OF FEDERAL
MONEY INTO OHIO CHARTERS IN THE
00:11:26STATE, YET, WE'RE STILL SEEN AS
A NATIONAL LAGGARD ON CHARTER
00:11:31SCHOOL QUALITY.
SO I THINK THERE ARE SERIOUS
00:11:33QUESTIONS ABOUT WHETHER THE
DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION'S PAST
00:11:37WILL DETERMINE ITS FUTURE.
WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THE
00:11:39$71 MILLION FROM THE FED GOES TO
THE HIGH-PERFORMING CHARTERS
00:11:42THAT NEED IT, AND THESE KIDS
DESERVE IT, FRANK LEE.
00:11:45KAREN: CHAD ALL THIS, LET ME ASK
ABOUT THE CRITICISM YOU WEIGHED
00:11:51AGAINST THE REPORT -- CHAD ALD
IS, LET ME ASK ABOUT THE
00:11:56CRITICISM.
THEY WOULD HAVE GOTTEN A D FROM
00:12:02THE STATE, SO THEY WERE NOT
HIGH-PERFORMING CHARTERS, AND
00:12:06THERE ARE THE DROPOUT RECOVERY
SCHOOLS THAT ARE OFTEN LOWER.
00:12:10LET ME ASK ABOUT ALL THAT.
MR. ALDIS: THE FIRST THING TO
00:12:13LOOK AT WHEN COMPARING THE
NUMBERS IN LOOKING AT THE
00:12:16PERFORMANCE IN CHARTER SCHOOLS
INVOLVED, IT MAKES IT LOOK LIKE
00:12:20THE CHARTER SCHOOL GRANT PROGRAM
IS GIVING TO LOW PERFORMING
00:12:24CHARTER SCHOOLS.
OUR ANALYSIS SHOWS THAT CHARTER
00:12:29SCHOOLS WHO RECEIVED THE GRANT
WERE SIGNIFICANT WE HIGHER
00:12:30PERFORMING VAN CHARTER SCHOOLS
THAT DO NOT RECEIVE THE GRANT ON
00:12:34PERFORMANCE INDEX, A STATE
ACHIEVEMENT MEASURE, AND
00:12:38VALUE-ADDED, WHICH IS GROWTH.
THERE WAS MORE GROWTH PER YEAR
00:12:42THAN CHARTER SCHOOLS THAT DO NOT
GET IT.
00:12:44IN THAT SENSE, THE DEPARTMENT
AND THE ADMINISTRATION OF THE
00:12:46PROGRAM WAS SUCCESSFUL IN THAT
IT WITH IDENTIFYING CHARTER
00:12:50SCHOOLS MORE LIKELY TO BE
SUCCESSFUL.
00:12:51STEVE AND I HAVE AN HONEST
DISAGREEMENT ABOUT WHAT THE
00:12:54PROPER COMPARISON IS WHEN YOU
ARE LOOKING AT CHARTER SCHOOL
00:12:58SUCCESS.
MOST OF OUR CHARTER SCHOOLS, AND
00:12:59TERMS OF RICK AND MORTAR CHARTER
SCHOOLS, ARE LOCATED IN
00:13:03ACADEMICALLY CHALLENGED AND
EDUCATIONALLY DISADVANTAGED
00:13:06AREAS.
MY THOUGHT IS A PROPER
00:13:09COMPARISON IS TO COMPARE THEM TO
SIMILAR SCHOOLS AND SEARCH FOR
00:13:14MORE STUDENTS AND NOT STATEWIDE.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT THAT MEASURE,
00:13:24CHARTER SCHOOLS, SOME ARE BETTER
THAN DISTRICT SCHOOLS THAT ARE
00:13:27AROUND AND SOME ARE NOT.
ONE OF THE ASPECTS OF IT -- WE
00:13:28NEVER SAY -- WE RELEASED A PAPER
A YEAR AGO THAT SHOWED THAT WHEN
00:13:36CHARTER SCHOOLS OR DISTRICT
SCHOOLS CLOSE, KIDS TYPICALLY
00:13:39BENEFIT ACADEMICALLY.
THEY END OF GOING TO A'S GOAL
00:13:44THAT IS HIGHER PERFORMING.
BUT WE KNOW IT IS PAINFUL FOR
00:13:46FAMILIES AND COMMUNITIES, AND
THE CANNOT BE DISCOUNTED.
00:13:49WHEN LOOKING AT THE SCHOOLS AT
CLOSE, IT IS ACTUALLY A FUNCTION
00:13:53OF CHARTER SCHOOLS.
WHEN A DISTRICT SCHOOL IS LOW
00:13:56PERFORMING, WE TURN IT AROUND 3,
4, FIVE TIMES, REMODEL, AND MANY
00:14:00TIMES YOU GET THE SAME LOWER
RESULTS AS BEFORE.
00:14:04WHEN A CHARTER SCHOOL IS NOT
PERFORMING WELL AND IS NOT
00:14:07SERVING THE COMMUNITY, NOT
ATTRACTING FAMILIES, IT SHOULD
00:14:10CLOSE.
YOU'RE NOT GOING TO SAY, WELL, A
00:14:14CLOSED, THAT IS A SUCCESS STORY.
NOT ALL CLOSURES ARE CREATED
00:14:17EQUAL.
KAREN: I WANTED TO ASK YOU ABOUT
00:14:20THAT, STEVE.
THE REPORT IS NOT NECESSARILY
00:14:23WORSE THAN THE LARGE URBAN
DISTRICT SPIRIT YOU HAVE THE BIG
00:14:27EIGHT DISTRICTS AND THESE
CHARTER SCHOOLS HE LOOKED AT,
00:14:30AND THEY ARGUABLY DID ABOUT THE
SAME.
00:14:31SO THAT IS THE ARGUMENT A LOT OF
SUPPORTERS HAVE, IF YOU WATCH
00:14:37INSPERITY AND ACCOUNTABILITY AND
YOU WANT FULL TREATMENT, THEN
00:14:40CAN'T YOU CLOSE DOWN FAILING
TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOLS IF
00:14:44YOU CAN CLOSE DOWN FAILING
CHARTER SCHOOLS?
00:14:45MR. DYER: FIRST OF ALL, SCHOOLS
AND THE PUBLIC DISTRICTS DO SHUT
00:14:52DOWN.
THE IDEA THAT YOU DO NOT HAVE
00:14:54SCHOOL BUILDINGS AND URBAN
DISTRICTS THAT ARE NOT THERE
00:14:58ANYMORE IS JUST NOT TRUE.
IT IS HAPPENING.
00:15:01BUT THE SECOND THING IS, CHARTER
SCHOOLS ARE NOT FOR PARENTS.
00:15:04THEY ARE NOT THE FOUNDATION OF A
COMMUNITY.
00:15:07YET.
I MEAN, AT SOME POINT, THEY MAY
00:15:13BECOME SO, AND I HOPE THEY DO,
BECAUSE THAT MEANS WE HAVE HAD A
00:15:16SUCCESSFUL CHARTER.
BUT WHEN THE LAND ORDINANCE OF
00:15:191785 SET UP PUBLIC SCHOOLS IN
THIS COUNTRY, IT SET ASIDE THE
00:15:24HEART OF EVERY TOWNSHIP FOR
PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
00:15:25WHEN YOU CLOSE DOWN A
TRADITIONAL PUBLIC SCHOOL OR
00:15:30PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT, IN MANY
WAYS, YOUR SHUTTING DOWN THE
00:15:34HEART OF THE COMMUNITY.
THAT IS WHY YOU TRY OVER AND
00:15:37OVER AND OVER AGAIN TO TRY TO
GET IT RIGHT, SO THE COMMUNITY
00:15:42HAS THE SENSE OF COMMUNITY THAT
IT NEEDS.
00:15:44WHILE IT IS TRUE THAT MOST OF
THE BRICK AND MORTARS ARE
00:15:47LOCATED IN THE BIG URBAN
DISTRICTS, ABOUT HALF OF KIDS
00:15:51THAT GO TO CHARTERS NOW DO NOT
COME FROM THE BIG EIGHT.
00:15:57IN FACT, EVERY SCHOOL DISTRICT
EXCEPT THE ISLAND DISTRICTS,
00:16:00DEPENDING ON WHICH YEAR IT IS,
THERE MAY OR MAY NOT BE KIDS
00:16:06IN THE DISTRICT.
EVERY ONE LOST FUNDING TO KIDS
00:16:11IN CHARTER SCHOOLS.
IN SOME WAYS WAS SOME ADVOCATES
00:16:14ARE SAYING IS THAT, PLEASE ONLY
COMPARE OUR PERFORMANCE WITH THE
00:16:18LOWEST PERFORMING CHARTER
SCHOOLS, I MEAN, THE LOWEST
00:16:24PERFORMING TRADITIONAL SCHOOLS,
EVEN THOUGH WE TAKE HITS FROM
00:16:26EVERYWHERE.
AGAIN, THAT IS THE -- EVEN IN
00:16:30SOME OF THE HIGHER PERFORMING
TURTLE SCHOOLS IN THE STATE THAT
00:16:34ARE LOCATED IN URBAN AREAS --
CHARTER SCHOOLS IN A STATE THAT
00:16:39ARE LOCATED IN URBAN AREAS, LIKE
COLUMBUS PREP, HAVE THEIR KIDS
00:16:42THAT DO NOT COME FROM COLUMBUS.
I THINK THAT THERE ARE NUANCES
00:16:44WITHIN THIS ARGUMENT THAT PEOPLE
COULD HAVE DISAGREEMENT ABOUT.
00:16:49KAREN: CHAD, DO YOU WANT TO BE
COMPARED ONLY AGAINST THE WORST
00:16:56STUDENTS IN THE STATE IN TERMS
OF THEIR DISTRICT?
00:16:57MR. ALDIS: OBJECTION, LEADING A
WITNESS.
00:17:01NO, OBVIOUSLY, WE HAVE BEEN A
VERY STRONG ADVOCATE FOR
00:17:05MEASURING CHARTER SCHOOLS,
ACTUALLY LOOKING AT THE
00:17:09STUDENTS.
DECEMBER OF 2014, THERE WAS A
00:17:15RESEARCH UNIT OUT OF STANFORD
UNIVERSITY, AND IT LOOK AT
00:17:18CHARTER SCHOOL PERFORMANCE
ACROSS THE STATE.
00:17:19THE ONE THING THAT WAS IN THE
REPORT THAT STARTED THE SHOW,
00:17:22AND I THINK SOME OF THE NUMBERS
STEVE MENTIONED SHOWED THIS, AND
00:17:28TERMS OF NUMBERS OF STUDENTS
BEING SERVED NOT IN URBAN AREAS
00:17:32FROM CHARTER SCHOOLS, YOU HAVE A
LOT OF ONLINE CHARTER SCHOOL
00:17:33ISSUES.
WE HAVE CERTAINLY BEEN POINTING
00:17:35OUT THE L YEARS -- THE FAILURES
AND WHERE THE CHARTER SCHOOLS,
00:17:41SHORT, BUT WE ALSO WE NEED TO
POINT OF THE SUCCESSES.
00:17:44BUT LOOKING AT THAT PARTICULAR
CRITICISM OF THE REPORT, STEVE'S
00:17:51GROUP DID A GREAT JOB COMPILING
THE DATA.
00:17:53THAT IS IMPORTANT.
WE NEED THE POLICYMAKING GOING
00:17:56FORWARD.
ONE OF THE THINGS I FOUND
00:17:58FASCINATING, AND THIS WAS A FLAW
IN THE OVERALL PROGRAM, 40% OF
00:18:01THE SCHOOLS BEING OPENED WERE
SPONSORED BY SCHOOL DISTRICTS.
00:18:06SO WHEN PEOPLE HEAR THAT THE
CHARTER SCHOOL COMMUNITY HAS RUN
00:18:08AMOK, YOU KNOW, STEVE IS SIMPLY
SAYING SCHOOLS ORGANIZED THE
00:18:15CHARTER SCHOOL, BUT MOST PEOPLE
ARE THINKING THAT PEOPLE ARE
00:18:18MAKING A PROFIT OR NONPROFITS OR
THEY DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY
00:18:22DOING, BUT THEY DO NOTHING ABOUT
THE LOCAL SCHOOL BURSTING --
00:18:26LOCAL SCHOOL DISTRICT DOWN THE
STREET, AND IT WAS THOSE
00:18:29SCHOOLS.
TWO CHARTER SCHOOLS IN UPPER
00:18:32ARLINGTON CLOSED IN THIS REPORT.
I THINK THAT IS AN IMPORTANT
00:18:35NUANCE THAT COULD BE EASILY
LOST.
00:18:38KAREN: STEVE, AND THIS REPORT,
SOME OF THESE SCHOOLS WERE
00:18:43ACTUALLY TIED TO TRADITIONAL
PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
00:18:45MR. DYER: AND AGAIN, THE REASON
THAT CHAD AND OTHERS KNEW THAT
00:18:49IS BECAUSE IT WAS IN THE REPORT.
BUT OUR CONCERN WAS NOT
00:18:52NECESSARILY WITH, AGAIN, WHY
EACH CHARTER CLOSED OR WHO WAS
00:18:58RUNNING EACH CHARTER.
OUR CONCERN WAS WITH THE
00:19:03GRANTMAKING PROCESS FROM THE
DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION AND THE
00:19:05U.S. DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION'S
LACK OF OVERSIGHT, FRANKLY.
00:19:09THEY DID ONE REVIEW OF HOW OHIO
WAS DOING ITS JOB 10 YEARS AGO.
00:19:13IT WAS REALLY LACK.
A COUPLE OF AMAZING THINGS THAT
00:19:16REVIEW FOUND, WHICH WAS DONE BY
WEST ED, WAS THAT AT ONE POINT,
00:19:23THE OHIO DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION
REQUIRED THAT ANY CHARTER THAT
00:19:25APPLIED FOR FEDERAL MONEY AT TO
SIT ON THE BOARD THAT DOLED OUT
00:19:28THE MONEY.
THAT IS GRANTMAKING 101, YOU DO
00:19:35NOT DO THAT BUT THAT IS HOW
THESE WERE GRANTED.
00:19:37SO IS IT ANY SURPRISE THAT SOME
POOR PERFORMERS GOT ON THAT
00:19:41BOARD AND DECIDED HE GOT THE
MONEY, AND THE POOR PERFORMERS
00:19:44GOT THE MONEY?
IT SHOULD NOT BE MUCH OF A
00:19:45SURPRISE.
THE OTHER CONCERN THAT IS
00:19:48SOMETHING WE NEED ANSWERS ON IS
THE PERSON WHO WAS OVERSEEING
00:19:51CHARTER SCHOOLS AND FINANCE AT
THAT TIME, THE ASSOCIATE
00:19:57SUPERINTENDENT, IS NOW THE
CURRENT STATE SUPERINTENDENT OF
00:19:58PUBLIC CONSTRUCTION.
WE NEED TO FIND OUT IF THERE WAS
00:20:02ANY SORT OF RESPONSIBILITY ON
HIS PART FOR THE WAY THAT THIS
00:20:04WAS SET UP OR NOT.
AND I KNEW NOT KNOW, BUT I THINK
00:20:08WE NEED TO FIND OUT.
@KAREN: AND YOU ARE TALKING ABOT
00:20:14THE NEW SCHOOL SUPERINTENDENT AT
HOPEFULLY HE WILL BE ON THIS
00:20:15SHOW.
I WILL ASK THAT.
00:20:18I WANT TO ASK ABOUT THIS IDEA,
THE COMMISSION THAT DOLED THAT
00:20:21MONEY, AND THERE ARE
REPRESENTATIVES OF THOSE GOALS
00:20:22ON THE COMMISSION.
$71 MILLION MAY BE COMING FROM
00:20:27THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.
HOW CAN WE TRUST THAT THE MONEY
00:20:28WILL NOT GO JUST TO THOSE
SCHOOLS BECAUSE THERE ARE PEOPLE
00:20:32ON THE COMMISSION FROM THOSE
SCHOOLS?
00:20:33MR. ALDIS: I CAN ABSOLUTELY TELL
YOU THAT WHAT STEVE JUST
00:20:37DESCRIBED IS AN EXAMPLE OF
REALLY POOR ADMINISTRATION.
00:20:41THERE IS NO WAY A GRANT PROGRAM
SHOULD BE ADMINISTERED IN THAT
00:20:44WAY.
IF THE NEW GRAND, IF OHIO BRINGS
00:20:50DOWN THE 71 MILLION DOLLARS AND
AWARDS IT, ISSUED SHOULD GO ONLY
00:20:54TO HIGH-PERFORMING CHARTER
SCHOOLS, SCHOOLS THAT HAVE TRULY
00:20:55MADE A DIFFERENCE AND RAISED
STUDENT ACHIEVEMENT.
00:20:59THAT IS WHAT THE DOLLARS ARE
FOR.
00:21:02THE ONLY WAY THAT WILL HAPPEN IS
IF THERE IS A RIGOROUS
00:21:03APPLICATION PROCESS THAT IS SET
UP, AND IT REALLY HAS THE
00:21:08POTENTIAL TO BENEFIT ALL CHARTER
SCHOOLS.
00:21:09EVERYONE WILL BE CHASING THESE
DOLLARS.
00:21:11THAT IS WHAT GRANTS DO.
IT WILL BE LIKE WHAT RATES TO
00:21:16THE TOP DID FOR THE COUNTRY
APPEARED YOU HAVE INNOVATIVE
00:21:17IDEAS AND NEW POLICIES, WAYS OF
DOING THINGS.
00:21:19CHARTER SCHOOLS, BEFORE THEY
OPEN, WILL HAVE A GREAT BUSINESS
00:21:23PLAN.
THEY WILL ANALYZE THE CURRICULUM
00:21:26AND DO GOOD MARKETING ANALYSIS
TO MAKE SURE THE SCHOOL IS
00:21:30NEEDED WHERE IT IS BEING OPENED.
ALL OF THOSE THINGS WIE
00:21:33FOR A HIGHER SUCCESS RATE WITH
OUR CHARTER SCHOOLS, BUT THAT IS
00:21:37ONLY IF WE ARE ABLE TO DRAW DOWN
THOSE DOLLARS AND HAVE THIS
00:21:38PROCESS.
THE DEPARTMENT HAS ALSO CHANGED
00:21:42A LOT IN THE LAST COUPLE OF
YEARS.
00:21:43THERE HAS BEEN SOME INCREDIBLE
IMPROVEMENTS IN TERMS OF THE
00:21:49CHARTER SCHOOL OVERSIGHT.
WE ARE STILL PROBABLY NOT YET
00:21:51WHERE WE'D NEED TO BE, BUT LOOK
AT WHAT THE LEGISLATURE DID WITH
00:21:54THE MOST COMPREHENSIVE CHARTER
SCHOOL REFORM IN OHIO'S HISTORY,
00:21:57AND NEW EVALUATION SYSTEM WITH
SPONSORS ALL ACROSS THE STATE
00:22:03AND THE FIRST DATA COMING OUT IN
OCTOBER, THIS IS EXCITING TIMES.
00:22:08CHARTER SCHOOLS, FOR THE FIRST
TIME, WHEN THEY ARE ACTING UP,
00:22:14THE DEPARTMENT HAS BEEN PUTTING
DOUBT ON THEM.
00:22:15THAT OVERSIGHT WAS A LONG TIME
COMING, BUT IT IS HERE NOW.
00:22:18WE SHOULD BE PLEASED AT THAT.
KAREN: THAT MAY ANSWER MY LAST
00:22:24QUESTION HERE TO BOTH OF YOU.
STATE AUDITOR DAVE YOST SAYS HE
00:22:29THINKS THE OHIO DEPARTMENT OF
EDUCATION MIGHT BE ONE OF THE
00:22:32WORST RENT AGENCIES, ESPECIALLY
WHEN IT COMES TO CHARTER SCHOOL
00:22:35OVERSIGHT.
STEVE?
00:22:36MR. DYER: THE TRACK RECORD IS
NOT GOOD.
00:22:39KAREN: WHAT CAN BE DONE?
MR. DYER: WELL, WE NEED TO STOP
00:22:43CHANGING STATE SUPERINTENDENTS
EVERY YEAR.
00:22:46WE HAVE HAD SIX IN THE LAST FIVE
YEARS.
00:22:48WE NEED -- WE HAVE HAD SIX IN
THE LAST FIVE YEARS WE NEED
00:22:53STABLE LEADERSHIP.
I ALWAYS JUDGE BUREAUCRACY, AND
00:22:57IF IT IS HEALTHY BUREAUCRACY, I
DO NOT HEAR A LOT OF PEOPLE
00:23:04THAT
HAVE COME OUT ON CHARTER
00:23:07SPONSORS AND STUFF, A GREAT STEP
FORWARD.
00:23:10I THINK IT IS JUST KIND OF
CATCHING AS UP TO THE NATIONAL
00:23:16NORM.
BUT I THINK IT IS A GREAT STEP
00:23:20FORWARD, THE WORK CHAD AND
OTHERS HAVE BEEN DOING.
00:23:24THE QUALITY IN THE CHARTER
COMMUNITY IS INVALUABLE.
00:23:28WE HAVE NEEDED TO HAVE THESE
CONVERSATIONS FOR 20 YEARS.
00:23:32AGAIN, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT
THIS $71 MILLION REALLY
00:23:37JUMPSTART'S THAT MOVE FOR
QUALITY IN OHIO.
00:23:40WE DO NOT NEED $30 MILLION OF IT
GOING TO CHARTERS THAT ARE NOT
00:23:46GOING TO SUCCEED ARE WE KNOW ARE
NOT SUCCEEDING RIGHT NOW.
00:23:51BUT UNTIL WE GET SOMETHING IN
HAND THAT WE KNOW WILL WORK, YOU
00:23:57KNOW, I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE
VERY HEALTHY SKEPTICISM ABOUT
00:24:02THIS AND TO HOLD THESE FOLKS
ACCOUNTABLE.
00:24:05KAREN: TO STEVE'S POINT ABOUT A
BUREAUCRACY OF PEOPLE WANTING TO
00:24:10WORK THERE, A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE
LEFT THE OHIO DEPARTMENT OF
00:24:15EDUCATION.
DO YOU AGREE WITH AUDITOR YOST
00:24:19THAT IT IS ONE OF THE WORST RUN
STATE AGENCIES?
00:24:23WHAT CAN BE DONE?
MR. ALDIS: THE AUDITOR HAS
00:24:27LOOKED AT MANY MORE STATE
AGENCIES THEN I HAVE TO.
00:24:31I CANNOT SAY.
I KNOW IN MY WORKING
00:24:35RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM AND WITH
MANY OTHER GROUPS, I HAVE FOUND
00:24:40THEM TO BE JUST FINE.
THAT IS PURELY PERSONAL.
00:24:44WHAT I WOULD SAY IS, THOUGH,
STEVE IS RIGHT ABOUT THE NEED
00:24:49FOR STABILITY.
THAT IS WHY WOULD THE STATE
00:24:53BOARD OF EDUCATION DID LAST
MONTH TO NOT ONLY HIRE DEMARIA,
00:24:58A SEASONED PROFESSIONAL WHO HAS
BEEN AROUND THE STATE AND
00:25:02UNDERSTANDS FUNDING AND POLICY
-- IF YOU ARE GOING TO TAKE
00:25:07ODDS, MANY PEOPLE WOULD HAVE
SAID THAT THEY WILL JUST PUT IN
00:25:13SOME POLITICAL PERSON WHO IS NOT
GOING TO KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON
00:25:18IN THE WORLD OF EDUCATION.
YOU KNOW WHAT?
00:25:2219-0, THE SAME BOARD VOTED TO
HIRE SOMEBODY WHO REALLY DOES
00:25:27HAVE A CLUE, WHO KNOWS WHAT IS
GOING ON, A PROFESSIONAL.
00:25:32SO THAT SHOULD GIVE YOU HOPE FOR
THE FUTURE.
00:25:36THEY HAVE HIRED A PROFESSIONAL.
THE STATE BOARD CANNOT AGREE ON
00:25:41WHAT TO HAVE FOR LUNCH, BUT THEY
HAVE VOTED UNANIMOUSLY.
00:25:45I THINK OHIOANS SHOULD SIT BACK
FOR A LITTLE BIT AND SEE IF MR.
00:25:51DEMARIAT
ON SOLID FOOTING GOING FORWARD.
00:25:54KAREN: THANK YOU BOTH VERY MUCH.
AND THAT'S IT FOR THIS WEEK.
00:25:59FOR MY COLLEAGUES AT OHIO PUBLIC
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00:26:04WATCHING.
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Note : Transcripts are compiled from uncorrected captions