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The State of Ohio

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All but five House Republicans team up to pass their budget, including a bond package for a new Browns stadium. They boosted funding for K-12 schools, but also put in a property tax refund requirement that districts say will be devastating. Studio guest is Paul Imhoff, who leads the statewide organization of school superintendents and administrators.

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00:00:39	All but five House Republicans
00:00:41	team up to pass their budget,
00:00:41	including a bond package
00:00:44	for a new Brown Stadium.
00:00:45	They boosted funding for K
00:00:45	through 12 schools,
00:00:47	but also put in a property
00:00:47	tax refund requirement
00:00:51	the districts say
00:00:51	will be devastating.
00:00:53	Details on that.
00:00:54	This weekend,
00:00:54	the state of Ohio.
00:01:12	Just.
00:01:14	Welcome to the state of Ohio.
00:01:16	I'm Karen Kasler.
00:01:17	House
00:01:17	Republicans sent the state
00:01:19	budget to the Senate
00:01:19	by a vote of 60
00:01:21	to 39 on Wednesday,
00:01:23	following
00:01:23	two months of testimony
00:01:25	and a little over a week
00:01:26	after they introduced
00:01:26	their version of governor
00:01:28	Mike DeWine spending plan,
00:01:28	which included big changes.
00:01:32	House Bill 96 passed
00:01:32	on a mostly party line vote.
00:01:35	Five Republicans
00:01:35	joined all Democrats in voting
00:01:38	no, including former Speaker
00:01:38	Jason Stevens.
00:01:41	The budget totals over $61
00:01:41	billion in state only funds.
00:01:45	It stopped the final two year
00:01:47	phasing of the bipartisan
00:01:47	fare school funding plan,
00:01:50	but puts more than a half
00:01:50	$1 billion
00:01:52	into K through 12 education.
00:01:54	So no district has a funding
00:01:54	cut from current levels.
00:01:57	It creates a 30% cap on cash
00:01:57	reserves for districts.
00:02:01	More on those two items
00:02:01	coming up.
00:02:03	the budget increases
00:02:03	funding to public libraries by
00:02:06	$5 million, but changes
00:02:06	funding for libraries
00:02:10	for a percentage
00:02:11	of overall state funds
00:02:11	to a state line item.
00:02:14	It ends Medicaid expansion
00:02:14	for nearly 770,000 Ohioans
00:02:18	if the federal match falls
00:02:18	below 90%.
00:02:22	It adds language to state law
00:02:22	recognizing only two sexes,
00:02:26	bans flags that aren't the US,
00:02:26	Ohio or POW
00:02:29	Mia flags at government
00:02:29	buildings scraps the Ohio
00:02:33	Elections Commission, which
00:02:33	enforces campaign finance
00:02:36	laws,
00:02:36	increases motor vehicle fees
00:02:39	and requires age verification
00:02:39	to view porn online.
00:02:43	The House budget also includes
00:02:43	$600 million in 30 year
00:02:46	state backed bonds for a $3.4
00:02:46	billion dome stadium project
00:02:51	for the Cleveland
00:02:51	Browns and Brook Park
00:02:53	Republicans,
00:02:53	who backed the development
00:02:55	from the Haslam Sports
00:02:55	Group, have said projections
00:02:58	provided by the Browns owners
00:02:58	show it's a good investment.
00:03:02	The team has testified
00:03:02	that the stadium
00:03:03	and surrounding retail
00:03:03	and housing will raise $1.3
00:03:07	billion more in income, sales
00:03:07	and other tax revenue
00:03:10	than the billion dollars
00:03:10	the state
00:03:12	will need to pay back
00:03:12	the bonds.
00:03:14	This is consistent with
00:03:14	our capital budget process.
00:03:17	It's consistent with 60 years
00:03:17	of history of issuing bonds.
00:03:20	It's consistent with what
00:03:20	all of our competing states
00:03:23	are doing to attract
00:03:23	new residents
00:03:25	and keep our young people
00:03:25	here.
00:03:28	And it's backed up by detailed
00:03:28	financial metrics under
00:03:30	which the new tax revenue
00:03:32	generated by this project will
00:03:32	pay the cost of the bonds,
00:03:35	with no out-of-pocket
00:03:35	expense for our taxpayers.
00:03:39	It is the most
00:03:40	conservative stadium
00:03:40	funding proposal in America.
00:03:43	In an unusual move, House
00:03:43	finance chair Brian Stewart
00:03:46	introduced an amendment
00:03:46	early on to require $50
00:03:49	million in upfront cash
00:03:49	from the team's owners
00:03:52	instead of the $38.5 million
00:03:52	they previously offered.
00:03:56	Since the same section of
00:03:58	legislation cannot be amended
00:03:58	twice in a calendar day,
00:04:01	Stewart's amendment blocked
00:04:01	two others
00:04:04	that sought to remove the bond
00:04:04	package from the budget.
00:04:07	Republican Representative Ron
00:04:08	Ferguson sponsored
00:04:08	one of them.
00:04:10	He ended up proposing
00:04:10	an amendment banning state
00:04:13	loans for professional sports
00:04:13	facilities that failed.
00:04:16	But Ferguson made his point
00:04:18	that he opposes state
00:04:18	funding for stadium projects.
00:04:21	And he says he's not alone.
00:04:23	you know,
00:04:23	a lot of people
00:04:24	that really wanted
00:04:24	to see this out of there
00:04:25	because a lot of people voted
00:04:25	yes on the budget,
00:04:27	that they would have preferred
00:04:27	this not being in there
00:04:29	because there's so many
00:04:29	great things to point to,
00:04:31	in this budget, as Chair
00:04:31	Stewart remarked to, but,
00:04:35	you know,
00:04:35	the one thing that I think
00:04:37	was the biggest sticking point
00:04:37	was the money,
00:04:39	the taxpayer money
00:04:39	going to the stadiums.
00:04:41	There's been no analysis
00:04:41	on the Haslem Sports Group's
00:04:44	tax revenue estimates
00:04:44	publicly released
00:04:46	from the Legislative Service
00:04:46	Commission
00:04:48	or from the Office of Budget
00:04:48	and Management.
00:04:51	Though
00:04:51	DeWine says he's seen it.
00:04:53	Well, at some point, I
00:04:53	think that will be released.
00:04:59	I have I have read it.
00:05:02	You know,
00:05:04	I didn't agree with all of it.
00:05:07	Agreed with some of it,
00:05:09	but I think the for me,
00:05:12	the the issue is much bigger
00:05:12	than the Browns.
00:05:15	And I know
00:05:16	we always talk about this
00:05:16	as being a Browns issue.
00:05:19	It's not really so
00:05:19	much a Browns issue.
00:05:21	We have a challenge,
00:05:26	to meet that challenges
00:05:26	that we have more professional
00:05:29	sports teams today
00:05:29	than we've had in the past.
00:05:32	The stadiums cost
00:05:32	more to build.
00:05:35	They cost a lot more
00:05:35	also to rehab,
00:05:38	just phenomenal
00:05:38	amount of money.
00:05:42	And we are going to face this
00:05:42	as a state,
00:05:46	years and years
00:05:46	and years into the future.
00:05:51	How are we going to pay for
00:05:51	these?
00:05:53	DeWine had wanted to double
00:05:53	the tax on sports gambling
00:05:56	operators to create a fund for
00:05:56	sports facilities projects.
00:06:00	But that tax hike
00:06:00	along with increases
00:06:02	on cigarets for a child
00:06:02	tax credit
00:06:05	and on marijuana, for grants
00:06:06	to bring driver's
00:06:06	ed back to high schools
00:06:08	and fund the 988
00:06:10	suicide hotline, among other
00:06:10	things, were scrapped.
00:06:13	One of the biggest changes
00:06:15	in the House
00:06:15	budget is the requirement
00:06:16	that anything over 30% in cash
00:06:16	reserves held by school
00:06:20	districts
00:06:21	be returned to the property
00:06:21	taxpayers who paid it.
00:06:24	Around $4 billion in total.
00:06:27	Last week,
00:06:27	I talked about that idea
00:06:28	with House Finance
00:06:28	Committee Chair Brian Stewart.
00:06:31	This week
00:06:31	I talked with Paul Imhoff,
00:06:33	who leads the statewide
00:06:33	organization
00:06:35	of school superintendents
00:06:35	and administrators.
00:06:37	we certainly are supportive
00:06:39	of the fair school
00:06:39	funding plan.
00:06:40	It's been it's
00:06:40	been developed over years
00:06:42	with many of the practitioners
00:06:42	in the field.
00:06:44	We also understand
00:06:44	we're in a difficult economic
00:06:47	time for the state,
00:06:47	and this is a tough budget,
00:06:49	and there's just not
00:06:49	a lot of money available.
00:06:51	And one of the things
00:06:51	that our superintendents
00:06:53	did across the state
00:06:53	after the governor's
00:06:55	budget came out
00:06:55	is they reached out
00:06:56	to their members of the House
00:06:56	talking about the deficit,
00:06:59	the devastating impact
00:06:59	on their students.
00:07:01	If those cuts were to happen.
00:07:03	And so we were really thankful
00:07:05	that the members of the House
00:07:05	did work
00:07:06	hard to come up
00:07:06	with a creative method,
00:07:09	to make sure
00:07:09	not only were
00:07:09	none of our districts cut,
00:07:11	but all of our traditional
00:07:11	public schools,
00:07:13	are receiving, additional
00:07:13	funds within the House budget.
00:07:18	Now, the, House finance
00:07:18	chair, Brian Stewart, said
00:07:21	what they are doing instead
00:07:21	of fully implementing the fair
00:07:24	school
00:07:24	funding plan is a bridge.
00:07:26	Now, you just mentioned
00:07:26	you supported the Fair school
00:07:29	funding plan.
00:07:30	It apparently is no longer
00:07:30	going forward.
00:07:32	Are you concerned
00:07:32	where that bridge goes?
00:07:35	Well, I think when you listen
00:07:35	to Chair Stewart
00:07:37	in the press conference,
00:07:37	he talked about fair
00:07:39	school funding was still
00:07:39	the bedrock of the formula.
00:07:41	So the formula is still in
00:07:43	the budget and it's the basis
00:07:44	that
00:07:44	the numbers are built upon.
00:07:46	And as far as our work
00:07:46	moving forward,
00:07:49	we are ready to work
00:07:50	with the General
00:07:50	Assembly moving forward,
00:07:52	to make sure
00:07:52	that the formula continues.
00:07:54	And for us,
00:07:55	this is the major thing
00:07:55	continues
00:07:57	to meet the needs of the kids
00:07:57	we serve.
00:07:59	Let's talk about the cap now.
00:08:01	And this is the cap on money
00:08:01	that school districts can hold
00:08:05	in their operating accounts,
00:08:05	essentially as advertised.
00:08:08	This plan is described
00:08:08	by Republicans
00:08:10	and support it
00:08:10	as the largest property
00:08:12	tax relief
00:08:12	bill in Ohio history
00:08:13	and the swiftest,
00:08:13	most significant property
00:08:15	tax relief
00:08:15	that lawmakers can provide.
00:08:18	It would send more
00:08:18	than $4 billion back
00:08:18	to property taxpayers
00:08:22	at a time
00:08:22	when they're already facing
00:08:23	huge property tax bills.
00:08:24	What's wrong with that?
00:08:26	Well,
00:08:26	I'm going to start with this.
00:08:27	So our superintendents
00:08:27	understand
00:08:30	and I talk to superintendents
00:08:30	every today
00:08:32	I was with 30 superintendents
00:08:34	in northwest Ohio
00:08:34	this morning.
00:08:35	Superintendents understand
00:08:37	the need to reform
00:08:37	our property tax system.
00:08:40	And so I want to start there.
00:08:41	It is an important topic
00:08:42	I think one that we all
00:08:42	all agree upon.
00:08:45	But when we look at this plan,
00:08:47	this is a plan that could have
00:08:48	a devastating impact
00:08:48	on the students we serve.
00:08:52	As you know, over
00:08:52	80% of our students
00:08:54	in Ohio attend
00:08:54	a traditional public school.
00:08:57	And as we look at this
00:08:57	cut of over $4 billion,
00:09:01	as as I look at that,
00:09:01	I see services
00:09:04	that are not going to be able
00:09:04	to be offered.
00:09:07	And I look at the unintended
00:09:07	consequences of that.
00:09:10	And as we look at it
00:09:10	being called a tax cut,
00:09:13	I think it's also important
00:09:13	to know
00:09:15	that at the end of the day,
00:09:15	it is a temporary
00:09:18	one time tax cut in everyone's
00:09:18	property tax rates.
00:09:21	After that
00:09:21	first year are likely
00:09:23	going to go right back up
00:09:23	to where they were.
00:09:26	And another, and unintended
00:09:26	consequence of this.
00:09:29	I think it
00:09:29	likely means more property
00:09:29	tax levies on the ballot,
00:09:33	which no one wants.
00:09:35	And I think it could overall
00:09:35	lead to higher property
00:09:38	taxes over time.
00:09:39	And so I think there's
00:09:39	a lot of work
00:09:40	to be done on this proposal
00:09:42	to make sure there aren't
00:09:42	unintended consequences
00:09:45	that could be damaging
00:09:45	to our kids
00:09:46	and damaging to our taxpayers.
00:09:48	You are invited to testify
00:09:48	at a hearing
00:09:50	along with some other school
00:09:50	officials, and we're asked
00:09:52	several questions
00:09:52	about the plan.
00:09:54	Obviously,
00:09:54	there was also the question
00:09:56	about if all school districts
00:09:56	are going
00:09:58	to be getting an increase,
00:09:58	then why should
00:10:00	there be cuts in school
00:10:00	district funding
00:10:04	because of this 30%
00:10:04	now 30% cap.
00:10:08	Well, I think we have to
00:10:08	look at what this is.
00:10:10	So I think it's very important
00:10:10	our schools,
00:10:13	operate in a very,
00:10:13	conservative manner.
00:10:16	And right now,
00:10:16	as we look at cash balances,
00:10:19	it is true that cash balances
00:10:19	are at historic highs,
00:10:23	but it's also true
00:10:23	that we're coming off a period
00:10:26	of historic levels of federal
00:10:26	investment in schools.
00:10:30	And again,
00:10:30	when you look at the ad,
00:10:32	the at the typical school
00:10:33	in Ohio, most of our schools
00:10:33	are small and rural.
00:10:37	And when they have
00:10:37	an influx of funds,
00:10:40	they are just not going
00:10:40	to find a way
00:10:42	to spend all of those dollars.
00:10:44	They are going to be smart,
00:10:44	and they are
00:10:46	going to be very conservative
00:10:46	in the use of those dollars.
00:10:50	And so what many school
00:10:50	districts have done
00:10:51	is they have saved these,
00:10:51	these dollars and,
00:10:55	and put them away.
00:10:56	And now they are sitting
00:10:56	on cash balances.
00:10:58	But they've also worked
00:10:59	with their,
00:11:00	communities and boards,
00:11:00	and they've come up for plans
00:11:03	for how they're going
00:11:03	to spend those.
00:11:05	For instance,
00:11:05	I was talking to a rural,
00:11:07	district
00:11:07	in northwest Ohio today,
00:11:09	and they have been working
00:11:10	together again with their,
00:11:10	community and board.
00:11:14	And they have aging roofs
00:11:14	and aging Hvac systems.
00:11:18	They did not want to go to go,
00:11:18	go, go to the ballot
00:11:21	for a bond issue
00:11:21	and raise taxes.
00:11:23	So they're going to use these
00:11:23	dollars that have been saved
00:11:26	to actually fund
00:11:26	all of those needs.
00:11:29	So they don't have to go back
00:11:29	to the, to the taxpayers.
00:11:34	And so I think those are
00:11:34	the types of plans
00:11:35	that are going on
00:11:35	around the state.
00:11:37	And I think it's important
00:11:39	to know the full scale
00:11:39	of what we're talking about.
00:11:41	Let's talk
00:11:41	a little bit more about that.
00:11:42	Republicans
00:11:42	have championed this idea
00:11:43	because they say district cash
00:11:45	carryovers are at historic
00:11:45	levels, have increased year
00:11:48	over year since tracking
00:11:48	started in 2012, $3.6 billion
00:11:51	then in these cash accounts
00:11:51	to $10.5 billion.
00:11:56	Now the largest amount is held
00:11:58	by the state's largest school
00:11:58	district, Columbia City.
00:12:00	Almost $395
00:12:00	million is a cash balance,
00:12:03	but that is 46.4%
00:12:03	of their operating
00:12:07	their expenditures
00:12:07	for the year.
00:12:09	And by my calculations,
00:12:09	though,
00:12:10	that the spending about $140
00:12:10	million back to taxpayers.
00:12:14	So these are
00:12:14	big amounts of money.
00:12:16	You also have southwestern
00:12:17	city schools
00:12:17	and Franklin County,
00:12:19	the second highest reserve
00:12:19	total, almost $181 million.
00:12:23	That's 82.2%
00:12:23	of the total expenditures.
00:12:26	And you've got 48 districts
00:12:26	that have over 100%
00:12:29	of their expenditures.
00:12:29	So double what they need.
00:12:31	Why should they be
00:12:31	sitting on this kind of money?
00:12:35	I mean, you mentioned building
00:12:35	projects, new roofs
00:12:37	and that kind of stuff,
00:12:37	but some of these districts
00:12:39	have really,
00:12:40	really big amounts of money
00:12:40	and percentages and reserves.
00:12:43	Well, I think
00:12:44	as you look
00:12:44	at some of these things,
00:12:45	for instance, in the
00:12:46	in the Columbus
00:12:46	Public Schools,
00:12:48	they actually recently
00:12:48	passed a levy.
00:12:50	And what we have to understand
00:12:50	and in, in the district
00:12:53	I served for over a decade
00:12:53	as the superintendent,
00:12:56	which was a non
00:12:56	20 mill floor, school
00:12:59	in, in those districts,
00:12:59	as property
00:13:03	values go up, property
00:13:03	tax rates go down.
00:13:07	So school districts
00:13:08	receive
00:13:08	the same amount of money
00:13:09	on all of their voted
00:13:09	operating levies.
00:13:12	So the only way for those
00:13:12	schools to deal with inflation
00:13:16	is they have to
00:13:17	come back to the voters
00:13:17	every four, four or so years,
00:13:20	and they have to ask for
00:13:22	a new levy,
00:13:23	because those levies bring
00:13:23	in a fixed amount of money.
00:13:26	And so what happens
00:13:27	in the first couple of years
00:13:27	of that levy cycle?
00:13:30	They are
00:13:31	bringing in extra funds,
00:13:32	and so they're building
00:13:32	a cash balance.
00:13:35	And then in the
00:13:35	last couple of years
00:13:35	of that levy cycle, they they
00:13:39	they are going into
00:13:39	deficit spending.
00:13:41	And so they are,
00:13:41	are are reducing
00:13:44	that cash balance under,
00:13:44	under this plan,
00:13:47	many of those districts,
00:13:47	instead of
00:13:49	doing that four year cycle,
00:13:49	they may be forced to the go.
00:13:53	I go to the ballot every year
00:13:53	for a new operating levy.
00:13:58	And I don't think
00:13:59	anyone wants school districts
00:13:59	to be on the ballot more.
00:14:02	So I keep coming back
00:14:02	to the unintended consequences
00:14:06	of this language.
00:14:08	Now, Ohio, as I
00:14:08	recall, has the highest number
00:14:10	of school levies
00:14:10	on the ballot, typically,
00:14:13	and I believe school levies
00:14:15	are starting to fail
00:14:15	more in larger numbers.
00:14:19	So this would potentially
00:14:19	really put
00:14:21	funding for school
00:14:21	districts in jeopardy.
00:14:23	But certainly taxpayers
00:14:23	will say
00:14:25	you should have to defend
00:14:25	where my tax money's going.
00:14:28	You know,
00:14:28	I've never I've never met
00:14:30	a superintendent
00:14:30	who didn't say,
00:14:32	I am happy
00:14:32	to go back to the voters and
00:14:32	they get to make that call.
00:14:37	But the reality
00:14:37	is of our property
00:14:38	tax system
00:14:38	in the state of Ohio,
00:14:40	which has been in place
00:14:41	in its current form
00:14:41	since the late 70s,
00:14:44	from that time,
00:14:44	we have had over 20,000 school
00:14:48	levies in the state of Ohio
00:14:50	and over
00:14:50	that same period of time.
00:14:52	So when I go back to the late
00:14:52	70s, the the average
00:14:56	operating millage for
00:14:56	our schools was about 28.5.
00:15:00	And, and as we sit here
00:15:00	today, it's about 30.5.
00:15:04	So 50 years, 20,000 levies
00:15:04	and our average property
00:15:09	tax rate has gone
00:15:09	up by less than two mills.
00:15:12	And there's been a
00:15:12	shift too in who pays property
00:15:15	taxes over time there
00:15:15	there has been a large shift.
00:15:18	So again,
00:15:18	we go back to the late 70s
00:15:21	and there was basically a 5050
00:15:21	split between residential
00:15:25	and agricultural a taxpayers
00:15:25	and business taxpayers.
00:15:29	And as we sit here today, that
00:15:29	that split is almost 75, 25
00:15:34	with the residential
00:15:35	and agricultural taxpayers
00:15:35	paying the 75%.
00:15:38	So the burden is definitely
00:15:40	more on residential taxpayers,
00:15:40	homeowners.
00:15:42	Well, certainly.
00:15:43	And I think that's
00:15:43	why more and more of
00:15:45	our homeowners
00:15:45	are coming forward rightfully
00:15:47	so, saying we have issues
00:15:47	with our property taxes,
00:15:52	especially, by the way,
00:15:52	our senior citizens who
00:15:55	who are on fixed incomes,
00:15:57	again, I, I was
00:15:57	a superintendent for years.
00:16:00	I've not met a superintendent
00:16:00	whose heart doesn't break
00:16:04	when they have
00:16:04	those conversations
00:16:05	with senior citizens
00:16:07	who are forced to between
00:16:08	supporting the schools
00:16:08	they love
00:16:10	and buying
00:16:10	the medicine that they need.
00:16:12	We definitely
00:16:12	need to fix that.
00:16:14	And of course,
00:16:14	the argument can be made that
00:16:15	everybody is on fixed
00:16:15	income at some point.
00:16:17	Yes. Also,
00:16:18	that hearing
00:16:18	the question was asked
00:16:20	whether there should be
00:16:20	an upper limit
00:16:22	on how much school districts
00:16:22	can hold in those accounts.
00:16:24	For example,
00:16:24	the state has a 10%
00:16:27	upper limit
00:16:27	that they're held to.
00:16:29	So is there an upper limit
00:16:31	the school district
00:16:31	should be held to?
00:16:32	And if there isn't, why not?
00:16:32	Or should there be?
00:16:35	So we recommend that
00:16:35	every local school board
00:16:39	have this decision with,
00:16:39	with, with their community.
00:16:43	And they adopt a policy
00:16:43	and they set a floor
00:16:47	and a ceiling based upon
00:16:47	the feedback of their local
00:16:51	A community.
00:16:52	So should there be a ceiling?
00:16:54	Of course, a
00:16:54	there should be a ceiling.
00:16:56	And that should be set
00:16:56	by the local community
00:16:59	and the officials
00:16:59	that they have elected
00:17:02	to lead their school district.
00:17:04	I want to ask you about,
00:17:05	the idea of
00:17:05	as being the swiftest
00:17:08	to property tax relief
00:17:10	that could be offered,
00:17:10	according to state lawmakers,
00:17:12	if this passes,
00:17:12	how long would it take?
00:17:15	It is
00:17:16	how do you set up the process
00:17:16	of returning money that
00:17:20	normally you're collecting?
00:17:21	How do you set up the process
00:17:22	of returning that money
00:17:22	to taxpayers?
00:17:24	Well,
00:17:24	how this system would work is
00:17:26	our school
00:17:26	districts would have to appear
00:17:28	between
00:17:28	the county budget Commission
00:17:30	and in the language
00:17:30	in the House.
00:17:31	The county Budget Commission
00:17:32	would be the county auditor
00:17:34	in the county,
00:17:34	and the county treasurer.
00:17:36	And in the past it's
00:17:36	been the county prosecutor.
00:17:38	But in the latest version
00:17:38	of the House
00:17:40	budget with patch,
00:17:40	which passed on, Wednesday,
00:17:43	the county prosecutor
00:17:43	would be replaced
00:17:46	or the chairman, excuse me,
00:17:46	by the president of
00:17:49	of the county, commissioners.
00:17:52	So they would have the
00:17:54	responsibility at their budget
00:17:54	hearing of reducing
00:17:58	the tax rate for that district
00:17:58	for one year, in order
00:18:03	to bring their cash balance
00:18:03	under that 30% number.
00:18:07	And then after that one
00:18:07	year, tax rates
00:18:10	would automatically revert
00:18:12	back to where the citizens
00:18:12	had voted them to be.
00:18:15	So when I talk about the fact
00:18:15	this is a temporary one time
00:18:19	tax cut,
00:18:20	I think it's really important
00:18:20	to understand what this is.
00:18:23	Will it take an amount of time
00:18:23	to stand up this process?
00:18:26	Because this has never been
00:18:26	done before?
00:18:28	Well, in the in the language,
00:18:28	we're
00:18:31	going to start on this process
00:18:31	almost immediately.
00:18:34	And so I think there are some
00:18:35	very good questions
00:18:35	that have to be asked
00:18:38	about the mechanics of it.
00:18:39	And if we have the capacity
00:18:39	to do that, as quickly
00:18:43	as it's,
00:18:43	as it's in the language,
00:18:45	I think, that is a question
00:18:45	for our county auditors
00:18:49	and others.
00:18:49	But I think it's definitely
00:18:49	going to be a heavy lift
00:18:52	when it comes to the timing.
00:18:53	You didn't have
00:18:53	a whole lot of time
00:18:55	to look at this proposal.
00:18:56	Again, this has not
00:18:56	come forward before.
00:18:58	This is not part of governor
00:18:59	Mike DeWine has proposed
00:18:59	budgets.
00:19:01	I don't think this idea
00:19:02	has really come out
00:19:02	before at all, has it? No.
00:19:05	So the
00:19:05	so the first time we saw
00:19:07	it was in the substitute
00:19:07	bill, just, just a week ago,
00:19:11	we testified in on it
00:19:11	just 48 hours after that,
00:19:15	our superintendents
00:19:15	and treasures and school board
00:19:17	members across the state
00:19:17	of Ohio, have been working
00:19:20	to come to terms with how
00:19:20	this would impact, them.
00:19:25	And I will tell you,
00:19:27	we are hearing more and
00:19:27	more stories as our districts
00:19:30	do the full analysis, again,
00:19:30	of some of the unintended
00:19:33	consequences of this.
00:19:35	And we have districts
00:19:35	who are already looking at
00:19:35	the fact that if this went
00:19:38	went into place
00:19:38	and all of those cash balances
00:19:42	were erased
00:19:42	basically overnight, they
00:19:45	they would be in the position
00:19:46	of either cutting programs
00:19:46	for our kids at a time
00:19:49	when we need to be focusing
00:19:49	on literacy and workforce
00:19:53	and other
00:19:53	very important priorities.
00:19:55	They would be forced to either
00:19:55	cut programs for kids
00:19:57	or immediately go on
00:19:57	the ballot to raise taxes.
00:20:01	So again, coming back to our
00:20:01	unintended consequences,
00:20:05	there are a couple of bills
00:20:06	that have been talked
00:20:06	about to deal
00:20:09	with property tax reform,
00:20:09	and this is in the budget.
00:20:12	But there are other bills.
00:20:13	For instance,
00:20:13	there's one that would deal
00:20:13	with the 20 mill floor,
00:20:15	which is you just referenced
00:20:15	it a little while ago.
00:20:17	It's a it's a whole it's
00:20:17	a whole thing there.
00:20:20	You were asked in the hearing
00:20:20	about what
00:20:23	property tax measures
00:20:23	you would support.
00:20:25	You said at the beginning
00:20:25	of this interview
00:20:26	that you want to see property
00:20:26	tax reform.
00:20:28	What do school districts
00:20:28	want to see with property
00:20:32	tax reform,
00:20:33	given that you're primarily
00:20:33	funded by property taxes?
00:20:36	Well, we definitely want to be
00:20:36	a partner.
00:20:39	So again,
00:20:39	as I said at the beginning,
00:20:40	we see this as an issue that
00:20:40	that needs to be addressed.
00:20:44	But we want to address it
00:20:44	in such a way
00:20:46	that it doesn't hurt
00:20:46	the children we are serving.
00:20:50	So we have said that
00:20:52	we are very supportive
00:20:52	of means tested property
00:20:55	tax relief, especially
00:20:55	for our senior citizens.
00:20:59	I think that is
00:20:59	very important.
00:21:00	We have talked about
00:21:01	a circuit breaker approach
00:21:01	that that has been discussed,
00:21:04	in the General Assembly,
00:21:04	and we're certainly open
00:21:08	to having conversations
00:21:08	about other ideas.
00:21:11	One of the things
00:21:11	we are absolutely not for,
00:21:15	is, going after and attacking
00:21:15	the 20 mill floor.
00:21:19	So when we talk about the 20
00:21:19	mill, mill floor,
00:21:22	that is something that is
00:21:22	predominantly used in our poor
00:21:26	rural districts.
00:21:28	And these are districts
00:21:28	who oftentimes are just a
00:21:32	getting by.
00:21:33	So changing that
00:21:33	20 mill floor,
00:21:35	which, as we understand, is
00:21:35	the only way they have to deal
00:21:38	with, with inflation,
00:21:38	would just absolutely
00:21:42	be devastating
00:21:42	to some of our neediest kids.
00:21:45	When I ask you
00:21:46	real quickly,
00:21:46	there was an effort
00:21:47	under former
00:21:48	Republican former Governor
00:21:48	John Kasich
00:21:50	to try to consolidate school
00:21:50	districts.
00:21:52	Have you heard any talk about
00:21:52	that being a possibility
00:21:56	for districts
00:21:56	to kind of deal with some of
00:21:56	these issues in general?
00:22:00	You know, I think there are
00:22:00	always rumblings about that.
00:22:03	And I think one of the things
00:22:05	we have to realize about Ohio,
00:22:05	that that that Ohio has
00:22:08	traditionally been a local,
00:22:08	control state,
00:22:11	as I get to travel
00:22:11	across the state of Ohio as,
00:22:15	as we represent
00:22:15	our public schools
00:22:17	across the state of Ohio,
00:22:17	Ohio has many small towns
00:22:21	that are wonderful,
00:22:21	beautiful places,
00:22:24	and our schools are the center
00:22:24	of of
00:22:27	all of those communities.
00:22:28	So I think
00:22:29	if you really put this idea
00:22:29	to the taxpayers of Ohio
00:22:32	and asked them
00:22:33	if they wanted to lose
00:22:33	those small school districts,
00:22:36	which are excellent,
00:22:36	by the way,
00:22:38	when when you look at
00:22:38	the results they are getting,
00:22:40	I don't think
00:22:40	the citizens of Ohio
00:22:43	are going to want to lose
00:22:43	that identity.
00:22:46	And while there could be
00:22:46	marginal savings,
00:22:49	I think there are other costs
00:22:49	you have to pay attention to,
00:22:52	that, could actually cost us
00:22:52	even more money
00:22:55	as we start to lose
00:22:55	maybe a sense of community
00:22:58	in some of our small towns.
00:23:00	And finally,
00:23:00	I know you're not a lawyer,
00:23:01	but there are questions about
00:23:01	whether this action is legal
00:23:05	because these levies
00:23:05	were approved
00:23:06	by local property tax.
00:23:08	Local voters.
00:23:09	And this would essentially
00:23:09	repeal some of those levies.
00:23:13	Is that
00:23:13	something that school groups
00:23:13	are looking at,
00:23:16	whether this is
00:23:16	even a legal action?
00:23:17	You know,
00:23:17	we have only had this
00:23:19	this information
00:23:19	for less than a week.
00:23:22	And so what
00:23:22	we've been focused on
00:23:22	right now
00:23:24	is how would this be
00:23:24	put into place
00:23:26	and how would this impact
00:23:26	the kids we serve.
00:23:30	And and at this point,
00:23:30	we are just very concerned
00:23:32	about the consequences
00:23:32	for our students.
00:23:35	As we look forward,
00:23:35	all of our schools, look,
00:23:39	look forward in a five year
00:23:39	forecast, which in this budget
00:23:42	could, I could be moving
00:23:42	to a three year forecast.
00:23:46	So we are at,
00:23:46	at, at an historic high
00:23:49	in our cash balances now,
00:23:49	and we're in fiscal year 25.
00:23:53	As we look forward
00:23:53	to fiscal year 27,
00:23:56	without this language around
00:23:56	cash balances,
00:24:00	we are projected
00:24:00	to be at a Sturrock low.
00:24:04	If we institute this,
00:24:04	this language,
00:24:07	we are at dangerous lows
00:24:07	with barely a month of cash
00:24:11	in the bank to cover payroll.
00:24:14	So, again,
00:24:14	this could be devastating.
00:24:16	And we've been spending
00:24:16	our time
00:24:18	trying to understand that
00:24:19	and make sure
00:24:19	everyone understands again
00:24:22	what I believe to be
00:24:22	the unintended consequences
00:24:24	of this policy idea.
00:24:26	Lawmakers
00:24:26	are now in spring break,
00:24:28	but the Senate will soon
00:24:28	pick up the budget,
00:24:30	aiming to voted out of that
00:24:30	chamber in mid to late June,
00:24:33	sending it
00:24:33	to a conference committee.
00:24:35	It has to be signed by DeWine
00:24:35	by June 30th.
00:24:38	By the way,
00:24:38	you can see that interview
00:24:39	with House Finance Chair
00:24:40	Brian Stewart in our archives
00:24:40	at State news.org.
00:24:44	And that is it for this week
00:24:44	from my colleagues
00:24:46	at the Statehouse News
00:24:46	Bureau of Ohio Public Media.
00:24:48	Thanks for watching.
00:24:49	Please check out our website
00:24:49	at State news.org
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Note : Transcripts are compiled from uncorrected captions